New coilovers or LSD?

[Forcefed]

I have not really looked into a new suspension set up or lsd until this week. I am having a hard time deciding what to get first. My overall goal is increase overall performance and feel of the car. I want more of a track car. Any suggestions would be helpful as I do not know much about suspension modification. By the way, my price rage for coilovers is $1000 or less, so I would need to get used coils or a cheaper new coil; obviously LSD would be more expensive.

[Yomama69]

I love when people do this. New suspension and LSD could cost you like 5K installed. Guess how much more the M3 would have cost you (assuming you bought your car new)? Just sayin.

[Forcefed]

I love when people do this. New suspension and LSD could cost you like 5K installed. Guess how much more the M3 would have cost you (assuming you bought your car new)? Just sayin.

Guess how much more insurance would have cost? And I didnt buy it new, CPO. And I've been hooked up with an installation and my budget it $1000 for coils, more for LSD. Not to mention my cars faster than an M3.

[mazdaspeed6]

im most likely doing lsd before suspension... but i think im holding off for a long time buying performance parts... i fully modded my car including bigger turbos in 13 months

[Forcefed]

im most likely doing lsd before suspension... but i think im holding off for a long time buying performance parts... i fully modded my car including bigger turbos in 13 months

Yeah, its a hard decision. These are two fairly expensive items so I once I buy one of these I will wait a while before buying the next.

[mazdaspeed6]

what are your other mods?

[Forcefed]

what are your other mods?

JB3, HPF intercooler, BSH oil catch can, AR catless downpipes, BMS dual cone intake, ER charge pipe, Sypanse BOV.

[mazdaspeed6]

id do lsd...

[mazdaspeed6]

actually i would do what i did and get all the mods and save the most expensive for last

[tunachris]

I did coilovers on my 335 first. I would like to do a LSD, but it is a very big chunk of change. Coil-overs did a lot, much flatter cornering and very stable. I thought of going to larger sway bars, but from researching it, I am getting the feeling that without a LSD there may be an issue with wheel hop.

If I do any more suspension mods, i will likely do the sway bars and LSD at the same time.

[Forcefed]

I did coilovers on my 335 first. I would like to do a LSD, but it is a very big chunk of change. Coil-overs did a lot, much flatter cornering and very stable. I thought of going to larger sway bars, but from researching it, I am getting the feeling that without a LSD there may be an issue with wheel hop.

If I do any more suspension mods, i will likely do the sway bars and LSD at the same time.

Yeah, I think I might get the $133 old BMW perf suspension and an LSD.

[Itsbrokeagain]

Yeah, I think I might get the $133 old BMW perf suspension and an LSD.

You really want to go the right route and use a quality suspension. BMW performance suspension is nice, but I find on hard use its still a little soft.

Your best bet is like AST4100s or Koni Yellow/Swift Spring Coilovers. Sure they are about $1800, but you will spend the money once, and thats it. When you put a low price limit on it, you will end up being unsatisfied and changing it out (again) and spending money (again). If you feel like wasting up to $500 on install and prolly another 2-300 on alignment, that is another $800, that you could have put on top of the $1000 that you originally wanted to spend.


There are pretty much no good coilover setups for less than a G...just remember you get what you pay for

[Forcefed]

You really want to go the right route and use a quality suspension. BMW performance suspension is nice, but I find on hard use its still a little soft.

Your best bet is like AST4100s or Koni Yellow/Swift Spring Coilovers. Sure they are about $1800, but you will spend the money once, and thats it. When you put a low price limit on it, you will end up being unsatisfied and changing it out (again) and spending money (again). If you feel like wasting up to $500 on install and prolly another 2-300 on alignment, that is another $800, that you could have put on top of the $1000 that you originally wanted to spend.


There are pretty much no good coilover setups for less than a G...just remember you get what you pay for

Thanks for the adivce, do you personally sell any coilovers? I was thinking about KW V1, KW V2 (used), ST V1, and FK silverline.

[xbox_fan]

I have had the same thoughts, coilovers or lsd, but after talking to Birds.uk I will ditch the RFTs. James claims that alone does more for the over all handling of our cars.

[Forcefed]

I have had the same thoughts, coilovers or lsd, but after talking to Birds.uk I will ditch the RFTs. James claims that alone does more for the over all handling of our cars.

Yeah, I need to do that also.

[Kylu II]

LSD....

[Itsbrokeagain]

Thanks for the adivce, do you personally sell any coilovers? I was thinking about KW V1, KW V2 (used), ST V1, and FK silverline.

I sell Koni Yellow/ Koni DAs and Swift Spring coilovers. They have proven to be my suspension of choice.

Unlike E90post, I will give you the laydown of my results with KWs and FKs and not expect it to be deleted and covered up.

KWs:
-Squeaky pistons and valving, tried to blame it on the springs
-Blowing out prematurely
-Shearing the front swaybar tabs off
-locking allen key in the front stripping out

FKs:
-blowing out prematurely
-front endlinks were $#@! design and fell apart after 3 months
-the welds around the bottom of the front strut housings would crack and send the koni insert out the bottom, causing loss of suspension.

Both I was not really a fan of, mostly because they give you a generic spring rate to be used, and expect the damping to make up for ride quality issues. Harold at HP Autowerks turned me onto Swift Spring coilovers and now that I can get infinite spring rates and spring heights, I can set a car up any way I want. You want good handling with a smooth ride while maintaing stock ride height? I can do it. You want it tucking tire and still ride like OEM suspension without blowing out suspension components? I can do it.

Sure its not the cheapest solution but you get what you pay for.

Also, I dont see any logic in buying used coilovers. I found that there is a very high turnover rate for used crap, especially in the tri-state. Whether you buy cheap $#@! or used $#@!, it is still $#@!, and you will be spending the money again to replace it. The only coilovers I would buy used are Koni DAs, because you can send them back to Koni and have them rebuilt as they are a double adjustable strut, meaning bound and rebound both have adjustment. These shocks are also used widely in the Koni Challenge Series and SCCA racing with E46 and E36 M3s.

Yellows you can do this with as well, but it would be cheaper to buy a new strut. You want to get KWs or FKs rebuilt? good luck....no one does it, they just sell you a new one.

I sell AST as well, since they just released the version for XIs and I can pair it up with Swift Springs, I will be pushing that now as well as H&R street coilovers if someone is really on a tight budget.

The other issue is a bit of a personal one. If you dont have the money now, you have a job right? Whats stopping you from saving a little bit longer? Pulling some extra hours? Getting a second job for a bit? Do you have to have that suspension RIGHT NOW? Do you have a race you need to attend? Most people just sacrifice because they want it right away, without having to wait. In all my years watching my bosses sell wheels, tires, stereos, performance work, etc, no one wants to wait. If you got it in stock great, if not they most likely will go someplace else to find it.

As the saying goes, good things come to people who wait.

[654]

Matt is right. The coilovers you listed are not really upgrades. What so you find being the problem with your suspension, if any?

RFT is quicker on dry when compared to the same nonRFT tires because of RFT's stiff sidewalls providing more contact area in cornering. Only if you move to an upgraded suspension as Matt suggested you will take care of the contact patch by suspension anyways and can benefit a lot from upgrading to stickier track tires.

LSD or coilovers depends on your needs. What do you find problematic and want to enhance?

I went first with LSD since I save in changing wearing parts mostly not before they wear out. So the condition of your shocks should affect your choice.

For occasional tracking the first thing to change in suspension is the front camber in my opinion...does not require any parts.

A final note, for e90 the old Bmw performance suspension would be of good value if still on sale. And if that kind of suspension actually is a solution for what you are after. One idea is to buy some M3 suspension bits and Koni FSDs is you put any value on comfort.

[Forcefed]

I sell Koni Yellow/ Koni DAs and Swift Spring coilovers. They have proven to be my suspension of choice.

Unlike E90post, I will give you the laydown of my results with KWs and FKs and not expect it to be deleted and covered up.

KWs:
-Squeaky pistons and valving, tried to blame it on the springs
-Blowing out prematurely
-Shearing the front swaybar tabs off
-locking allen key in the front stripping out

FKs:
-blowing out prematurely
-front endlinks were $#@! design and fell apart after 3 months
-the welds around the bottom of the front strut housings would crack and send the koni insert out the bottom, causing loss of suspension.

Both I was not really a fan of, mostly because they give you a generic spring rate to be used, and expect the damping to make up for ride quality issues. Harold at HP Autowerks turned me onto Swift Spring coilovers and now that I can get infinite spring rates and spring heights, I can set a car up any way I want. You want good handling with a smooth ride while maintaing stock ride height? I can do it. You want it tucking tire and still ride like OEM suspension without blowing out suspension components? I can do it.

Sure its not the cheapest solution but you get what you pay for.

Also, I dont see any logic in buying used coilovers. I found that there is a very high turnover rate for used crap, especially in the tri-state. Whether you buy cheap $#@! or used $#@!, it is still $#@!, and you will be spending the money again to replace it. The only coilovers I would buy used are Koni DAs, because you can send them back to Koni and have them rebuilt as they are a double adjustable strut, meaning bound and rebound both have adjustment. These shocks are also used widely in the Koni Challenge Series and SCCA racing with E46 and E36 M3s.

Yellows you can do this with as well, but it would be cheaper to buy a new strut. You want to get KWs or FKs rebuilt? good luck....no one does it, they just sell you a new one.

I sell AST as well, since they just released the version for XIs and I can pair it up with Swift Springs, I will be pushing that now as well as H&R street coilovers if someone is really on a tight budget.

The other issue is a bit of a personal one. If you dont have the money now, you have a job right? Whats stopping you from saving a little bit longer? Pulling some extra hours? Getting a second job for a bit? Do you have to have that suspension RIGHT NOW? Do you have a race you need to attend? Most people just sacrifice because they want it right away, without having to wait. In all my years watching my bosses sell wheels, tires, stereos, performance work, etc, no one wants to wait. If you got it in stock great, if not they most likely will go someplace else to find it.

As the saying goes, good things come to people who wait.

Thanks for the advice, that actually helped a lot. And no I do not currently have a job, I am in college. I just have money saved up from random things, summer jobs, birthdays, Christmas ect.
I have decided not to get ANY used suspension, and I will most likely wait to get something better. I have all the money I need, I just dont want to spend that much right now. The only thing I am kind of looking at now is eibach pro system plus and H&R coils. So if I dont get either of those I will just wait to get high quality coilovers. I do not track the car or anything, I just want something that will allow me to push the car a little harder. That is why I am having problems buying an expensive set up right now.

Matt is right. The coilovers you listed are not really upgrades. What so you find being the problem with your suspension, if any?

RFT is quicker on dry when compared to the same nonRFT tires because of RFT's stiff sidewalls providing more contact area in cornering. Only if you move to an upgraded suspension as Matt suggested you will take care of the contact patch by suspension anyways and can benefit a lot from upgrading to stickier track tires.

LSD or coilovers depends on your needs. What do you find problematic and want to enhance?

I went first with LSD since I save in changing wearing parts mostly not before they wear out. So the condition of your shocks should affect your choice.

For occasional tracking the first thing to change in suspension is the front camber in my opinion...does not require any parts.

A final note, for e90 the old Bmw performance suspension would be of good value if still on sale. And if that kind of suspension actually is a solution for what you are after. One idea is to buy some M3 suspension bits and Koni FSDs is you put any value on comfort.

There is no problem with my current set up, I have the sport suspension and everything works fine. I am just looking to take the car to the next level performance wise. My real goals are just to have an extremely fast car that can handle well too. I already have full bolt ons and I am just trying to decide which mod will help me the most. I will not be tracking the car very often, maybe 1 or 2 times a year max. I guess what I am looking for is just more of a connection with the car.

[Itsbrokeagain]

The other issue concerning tires is that runflats might feel 'sharper' but their slipping point is more abrupt and they will break traction with less notice than a non runflat or different brand. I took my 335 out on a few courses and had my friend whos an instructor teach me how to control my car at the limit of adhesion...and RFTs are horrible at doing so.

They will do the job on a stock car, but when you stiffen up the suspension and ask the tires to more work (now that the suspension isnt mushing around), they will give up in protest much more easily. Notice how i just said they will break away easier, but how they do it is not changed. There is hardly a warning point, once you start hearing them squeal it will usually swing the back around a fraction of a second later.

A good high performance non runflat will absorb bumps easier, keeping the tire on the road. It might have a softer turn in than an RFT tire but there are ways to make up for it. I prefer Toyo R888s or Sport Cups for DE use. They communicate well, they break the limit of adhesion gradually, allowing you to keep your car in control, and give you a lot of feedback in the steering wheel.

For street use i like Toyo T1Rs, Pilot Sports, and even Veredstein in some instances. For those who dont know, Veredstein has been making tires for Porsche, VW, and Audi for the last 30+ years. They are responsible for the collapsable space-saver spare as well as making high-po tires.

[Forcefed]

The other issue concerning tires is that runflats might feel 'sharper' but their slipping point is more abrupt and they will break traction with less notice than a non runflat or different brand. I took my 335 out on a few courses and had my friend whos an instructor teach me how to control my car at the limit of adhesion...and RFTs are horrible at doing so.

They will do the job on a stock car, but when you stiffen up the suspension and ask the tires to more work (now that the suspension isnt mushing around), they will give up in protest much more easily. Notice how i just said they will break away easier, but how they do it is not changed. There is hardly a warning point, once you start hearing them squeal it will usually swing the back around a fraction of a second later.

A good high performance non runflat will absorb bumps easier, keeping the tire on the road. It might have a softer turn in than an RFT tire but there are ways to make up for it. I prefer Toyo R888s or Sport Cups for DE use. They communicate well, they break the limit of adhesion gradually, allowing you to keep your car in control, and give you a lot of feedback in the steering wheel.

For street use i like Toyo T1Rs, Pilot Sports, and even Veredstein in some instances. For those who dont know, Veredstein has been making tires for Porsche, VW, and Audi for the last 30+ years. They are responsible for the collapsable space-saver spare as well as making high-po tires.

so basically if I dont have non-runflats dont get a suspension? Because I am getting new tires and rims this summer.

[Itsbrokeagain]

so basically if I dont have non-runflats dont get a suspension? Because I am getting new tires and rims this summer.

No you need to get both. They go hand in hand.

[oddjob2021]

you should get an LSD, trust me, you wont be disappointed, it should end up being more expensive though all in all, i would get the suspension once you see your stock system fading, otherwise an LSD will make the world of difference on a torque monster like the n54.

[CookieCrisp]

I love when people do this. New suspension and LSD could cost you like 5K installed. Guess how much more the M3 would have cost you (assuming you bought your car new)? Just sayin.

New suspension = $2000 installed. Used in good condition around $1200 installed.
LSD is around $2000 - $2500 installed depending on whether you have a bolted or welded ring gear.
Both together can come out to $3200 if you look around.

I say go for the LSD, it may be more expensive but it makes the car MUCH more controllable and is a definite mod for anyone who spends time sideways or on the track.
The stock suspension isn't terrible - nothing a little extra driver correction can't fix

[SSDD]

First I would like to echo everything Matt said about suspension. If you go that route let me know so I can dig up some links for you so you can do the research yourself if you'd like.

Onto the question- imho if you aren't really tracking the car or looking for an adjustable drop (read nice wheels) I'd do the LSD myself. Good luck and you can't go wrong either way honestly.